Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

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MurdaWoodz438
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Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by MurdaWoodz438 » December 30th, 2013, 12:00 am

The person who wrote this made some very good points and comparisons on gang violence in Chicago. This gives people who were fortunate enough to not have experienced it, a pretty good look into how dangerous Chicago was in the 80's and 90's and even the 70's, especially for gang members. Although both are violent, I believe it shows how different the atmosphere is nowadays versus "Back in the Day". Most of all I think this gives one a clear view of what's ahead for the city of Chicago and the people in it.

Safely Passing Through the History and Territory
of Chicago Street Gangs
John M. Hagedorn, Ph.D.

Chicago Gang Research and the Changed Threat to School Children

Gang violence in Chicago has been a major topic of social science research from the
1920s to today.

a/ Classic Gang Research

The acknowldeged “Father of Gang Research” is Frederic Thrasher who studied “1313”
gangs in 1920s Chicago and defined gangs as shaped by conflict. Shaw & McKay
followed in this “Chicago School” traditon by finding gang violence was the product of
disorganized neighborhoods regardless of which ethnic group resided there. Short &
Strodtbeck studied the “aleatory”or spontaneously random processes by which gang
violence often occurred. Studies by Irving Spergel on Chicago gang violence and his
outreach program in Little Village led to the US Department of Justice to adopt
Spergel’s “comprehensivse gang intervention plan” as a model program for the entire
country.

Richard and Carolyn Block have done extensive work on gang homicide and have
differentiated between “expressive” homicides, which are more spontaneous and
related to local conflicts and lack of self control vs. “instrumental” homicide which are
calculated, more planned killings. Recently Andrew Papachristos has done evaluations
of the CeaseFire gang intervention program and elaborate quantitative studies of the
relationship between patterns of gang homicide and distressed neighborhoods.

Unfortunately, there are a only handful of historical studies of gangs including Sudhir
Venkatesh’s history of gangs in Robert Taylor Homes and Andrew Papachristos study
of the results of the 1990s federal prosecution of the Gangster Disciples. Among Latino
gangs, there are even fewer historical studies, marked by only Felix Padilla’s history of
a north side Puerto Rican gang. Andrew Diamond has published a unique history of
20th century youth gangs up to the 1960s.

One major finding of almost every Chicago research study is that gangs are a significant
contributor to high rates of violence in both African American and Latino communities.
What is most significant for school closings, however, is that the nature of gang
violence in the last years has fundamentally changed. This trend, recognized by
community residents and law enforcement officers, can be seen in my own studies of
Chicago gangs.

b/ The historical context of Chicago’s contemporary gang violence
My own work combines detailed histories of Chicago gangs with analysis of the reasons
for the level of Chicago’s homicide rate. In the 1950s and 1960s, new gangs began all
across Chicago and those gangs have persisted now for more than half a century. Tens
of thousands of Chicago young people, many as early as elementary school, join
gangs. Gang membership continues into adulthood for many of them and traditions are
often passed down to their children. Neighborhoods all over Chicago are marked by
gang boundaries as represented in the CPD and Chicago Crime Commission maps.

Gangs in 1960s Chicago were different than most prior gangs and they quickly
expanded as multi-neighborhood race-based alliances of local sets. Cross
neighborhood gang wars raged from the 1960s on. For example, in 1973, 83 people
were killed in East Garfield Park, 58 in North Lawndale, and 66 in Englewood alone.
The now defunct People & Folks Coalitions, which were formed in prison in 1978, had
as a goal, in part, to control violence both within the prisons as well as on the streets

(see exhibit 1).

These efforts had only moderate success as violence between “People” and “Folks”
gangs continued into the 1980s. What was significant about gangs during this time was
their hierarchical organization and control of street activity by leadership in prison.
In my
articles and in my book, A World of Gangs, I explained Chicago gangs as having
institutionalized, meaning they were permanent fixtures in Chicago and Illinois prisons
that would not go away “no matter what we do.” The 1990s, however, would
fundamentally alter the nature of Chicago gangs and their violence.

Two events shook Chicago’s gang world and these events have decisive significance
for how to prepare children today for school closings. In the 1990s, Mayor Daley
decided to tear down the CHA housing projects and disperse the residents, mainly to
the far south and west sides (see exhibit 2). This stands in sharp distinction to the
decision by New York City’s Mayor Koch to substantially invest in public housing and
not displace the residents. In my Urban Affairs Review article, I concluded this was a
major reason why Chicago’s homicide rate did not drop like New York Citys, or, for that
matter, like many other large US cities during that time.

Through interviews with displaced gang members, I showed this dispersal of CHA
residents raised gang tensions in those areas and schools. For example, Roseland
was described to me by gang members who moved their from Robert Taylor Homes as
“The Wild, Wild, West” where shootings were the unanticipated result of gang members
mixing with rivals as well as their inability to get along with members of the same gang.
Both schools and communities were unprepared for the influx of gang members and
were unable to contain the upsurge in violence.

On both the west and far south sides, gang members moved into neighborhoods where
housing was available, not necessarily into areas controlled by their own gang. This
resulted in making neighborhoods on the west and far south side much less
homogenous and more volatile. The gang maps of the CPD and Chicago Crime
Commission are misleading in representing “gang boundaries” as bounded and homogenous. Today these gang neighborhoods are much more fluid and volatile than
at any time in the past 40 years.

The other event that changed the nature of gangs and violence today, were the
internecine gang wars of the 1990s. Rather than battles between “People” and “Folks,”
these wars took place within “nations” and led to the most violent years in Chicago’s
history. The Black Disciples/Gangster Disciples war mainly took place on the south side
while Vice Lord sets fought one another on the west side.For example, in 1992, 98
people were killed in East Garfield Park, 62 in Englewood, and 60 in North Lawndale.
Among Latinos, a “War of the Families” cost many lives of Latin Folks gangs. The wars
of the 1990s had homicide rates twice that of the “spike” of 2012 or any year since 2004

(return to exhibit 1).

These horrific wars, along with changed, more gang-heterogenous neighborhoods,
shattered the hierarchical structure of Chicago gangs and discredited their leadership.

In the last ten years, Chicago’s established gangs have turned in on themselves and
killings are often intra-gang, not just between gangs. Additionally, my research contacts
have consistently reported the formation of new, younger, non-affilliated gangs that are
not part of Chicago’s half century old institutionalized gangs and represent a contant
challenge to them.

While the level of violence in Chicago today is much less than in the gang wars of the
1990s, it is more unpredicable and dangerous for young people. Violence today,
according to my historical research and contacts among community residents, gang
members, and police officers, is fundamentally different than the organized gang
violence of the 1990s. Unlike gang “hits” of past years, violence today is more
spontaneous and much less amenable to control by “OGs” — a street term for “Old
Gangster” or influential gang elders. What children walking past rival gang turfs face
today, is not just violence between rival gangs, but the spill over of violence within
gangs as well unpredictable violence with new, sometimes even un-named gangs.
This
situation calls for caution and much more investigation of the actual situation than is
apparent from reading the CPS Safe Passage contracts or listening to the testimony of
Mr. Tyrrell [CPS Deputy Chief Administrative Officer Tom Tyrrell].

c/ The nature of risk to elementary school children.

This changed gang situation poses some old and some very new threats to children
who move from schools on one gang turf to another. When African American children
move into Latino gang controlled areas, the risks are racially based and past experience
of racial hostility at Little Village High School should not be easily dismissed.

Within African American neighborhoods, two sets of problems arise during transit
across gang turfs. First, gang resentment of students coming from rival gang
neighborhoods can mean direct, gang-related violence. A violent incident that occurred
the last week or the last year can suddenly erupt and recoil on unsuspecting children.
Second, gang rivalries can spill over and school children traveling across gang boundaries can become victims of gun fire meant for other gangs or in factional
disputes. The closing plan for some schools literally throws kids into the line of fire.

Finally, problems don’t stop once the kids get to a new school. Especially when the
“welcoming” school is on or near rival gang turf, tensions will certainly escalate. The
CPS plans for the welcoming school reported on by Mr. Tyrrell do not appear to have a
gang component and he admits they lack specificity. Tensions getween families and
gangs when someone has died or was the victim of violence do not go away after a one
hour session teaching kids “how to get along with one another.” This is one of the most
disturbing aspects of the school closing plans for schools where children change gang
turf.

In a nutshell, gang violence in Chicago today is more unpredictale and uncontrollable
than ever before. This means when school children cross gang boundaries the risks are
complex they need careful, specific, informed attention or else children can die.

Case Studies and Generalization

I looked at the entire list of school closings and it was quickly apparent that the extent of
the plan far exceeded my capacity to comment on so many schools. Each school
closing presents different, unique problems with gangs, and indeed the lack of a
specific, tailored plan for each schools’ specific gang problem is most troubling. I am
most familiar with Lawndale and the Vice Lord sets there and I decided to look carefully
at three school closings in that neighborhood. I also contacted community residents,
gang members, and law enforcement officials from other neighbhoods where children
need to cross gang boundaries to see if the method of my analysis might be valid for
those areas as well.

a/ Pope to Johnson

The attendance area of the closing Pope school adjoins turf of both the Conservative
Vice Lords and the New Breed. Students walking north to Johnson will cross areas
adjacent to the turf of the Black Souls. The Johnson attendance area also includes tuf of
the Traveling Vice Lords (see exhibit 3 and 4). The CPS safety plan asserts children
walking Albany Avenue to their new school do not aggravate “existing gang conflicts”
(see exhibit 7) is dead wrong and on more than one level.

First, there has been more than 25 years of warfare between the Black Souls and New
Breed since Booney Black, the New Breed leader, was stabbed in prison by a Black
Soul in 1987. This longstanding hatred carries down to the children of gang members
who live in those areas. Rivalries between Vice Lord sets, in this case Travelors and
Conservatives, has beeen intermittent. I was told by one former Vice Lord leader that
on July 1st, as I was investigating the situation, there were conflicts between the two
Vice Lord sets.
But the CPD and Crime Commission maps are inaccurate and misleading as to the
depth of the problem in at least three ways. First, one of the major gangs in that area,
the Albany Lords, are not even depicted on the map nor are they listed in the CCC
“Gang Book.” Gang leaders from that area told me this Vice Lord set is a force to be
reckoned with by any kids walking the “Albany Avenue gauntlet” from Pope to Johnson.
One mother told me that kids had been posting on FaceBook that anyone trying to go
through their turf on Albany would get assaulted. She described the situation as worse
than when the projects first came down and new gang members moved to Lawndale.

Second, the neat boundaries of gangs as seen on the map do not reflect the
demographic changes that shook the west side when the CHA projects came down. In
those years gang members from the projects moved into available housing, not
necessarily to their own gangs’ turf. This exacerbated tensions and makes violence
more unpredictable as rival gang members sometimes live side by side. The old neat
and concise gang boundaries do not exist any more.

Third, the area has seen the emergence of new, unaffiliated gangs that owe no
allegiance to any established gang nation. I was told by one gang leader two years ago
with some indignation, that kids in Douglas Park were sporting “blue and red bandanas
like from LA.” He said: “This is Chicago. They ain’t supposed to do that.”

I do not see any planning by CPS to deal with such a complex gang situation. They are
just plain wrong that this specific Lawndale plan does not exacerbate gang tensions. In
this situation, forcing children to walk through multiple, violent, and unstable gang turfs
undoubtedly puts them at risk. This closing, from the point of view of the safety of
children, is ill-advised and risks the lives of children.

b/ Henson to Hughes

Also in North Lawndale, the new attendance area of the Henson and Hughes schools
includes a variety of gang turfs that children would have to pass through (see exhibits 5
and 6). Depending on where a student lived, s/he would have to move through areas
controlled by the New Breed , Gangster Disciples, Black Souls, all former “Folks” gangs.
The Four Corner Hustlers and many Vice Lord families also live in this traditional Vice
Lord area. The first thing one Vice Lord gang leader told me about Henson and Hughes
was that the area between the schools was home to a major drug business by the New
Breed. His unsolicited opinion was that sending kids through that “war zone” was
“crazy.”

The instability among established gangs and the emergence of new gangs also applies
to this area. The gang situation is especially dangerous and the CPS conclusion that
forcing chldren to walk through a gang “war zone” is not especially risky is irresponsible
(see exhibit 7).

c/ Paderewski to Cardenas and Castellanos
A different kind of problem can be found in the planned closing of Paderewski School
just a few block away from the other North Lawndale schools and on the border with
South Lawndale, called Little Village. The plan for this school sends African American
children under the tracks and to two schools, Cardenas and Castellanos, squarely
within Latin King turf. The safety plan, incredibly, says there are “no significant safety
concerns.”

My own astonishment at such a statement was supported when I spoke to a Latin King
leader that said “any black kids coming into King territory would be in for trouble.” My
own research, several years ago lends support to this idea. After the North Lawndale
High School Collins was closed I was conducting research among Vice Lords and
holding intergenerational meetings. The purpose was to try to imbue the spirit of the
1960s CVLs, who “went conservative” and rejected the name “gang,” to the younger
generation. The young VLs told me after Collins closed they had to fight their way to
Little Village High School. I asked them, since they had to go through both Latin King
and 2-6 turf whether the problem was gangs or race. “Race! Race! Race!” they yelled
out with anger and emotion. From Los Angeles to Chicago, Latino/African American
tensions are escalating and need to be taken seriously. “No significant safety concerns”
makes a mockery of serious safety planning for children in this closing.
d/ Other Areas. Can we generalize?

I did not have time to go through each of the closings and I am not familiar enough with
neighbohroods in each situation. In the three schools above, gangs and racial factors do
not seem to have been seriously taken into account by planners. Mr. Tyrrell testified that
the CPS central planners put a model plan into place and he admitted he knew nothing
of even the racial composition of schools and apparently little about Chicago gangs.
What this affidavit asserts is that the planning process needs to be careful and specfiic
and take into account gang problems that need more than superficial investigation and
hasty bureaucratic decisions.

My method of analysis of the schools in North Lawndale can be applied to other
schools.

For example, the closing of Peabody school into Otis is claimed by CPS to result in
“minimimal serious or safety concerns.” While this closing represents school in
gentrifying areas, when I asked a gang leader from the area what he thought, he said
Otis was “right in middle of Satan Disciple” turf. The gang in that area, he said, would
not take “kindly” to the kids of Harrison Gents parents coming to their school. The
Harrison Gents turf surrounds closing Peabody. The Satan’s Disciples have a long
history of violence and to say that safety concerns in that school would be “minimal”
reflects at best, a lack of knowledge.

A different issue arises when we travel to far south side schools which are slated to be
closed. In some of these cases, CPS appears to recognize there are serious gang
problems but plans to go ahead with closures anyway. For example, CPS says closing Garvey and Cohn should proceed even though an intersection children would cross,
103rd and Halsted, is the “epicenter of violence.” Closing West Pullman, Songhai, and
Owens is okayed even though Altgeld Gardens, where some students live, “is isolated
with a history of violence” and perplexingly the report says: “Large concentration of
active gang conflicts and gang boundaries create major safety challenges.”

In my research on the consequences of the displacment of CHA tenants, I interviewed
many gang members from what they call “the hundreds,” the far south side area where
many displaced gang members moved. Most had dropped out of school due to violent
disputes that were mainly intra-gang. Like on the west side, the far south side has
traditional rivalries, intra-gang conflicts, and numerous new gangs which are wild cards
in the mix. Violence is unpredictable and uncontrollable. My analysis of west side
schools, that a detailed, specific risk analysis is necessary to truly understand student
safety concerns, holds for the far south side as well where children must cross gang
boundaries.

e/Special Education Children and Gangs

I have no professional expertise on special education children. My research, like others,
has found that gangs are made up of youth from many different kinds of families and
are composed of different kinds of people. Not all are from troubled families, but most
are. Gangs recruit from available youth within a neighborhood and for a variety of
purposes. Very young kids, in elementary schools, are useful as look-outs, runners, and
for holding drugs and guns for older gang members.

Youth that are cognitively challenged are recruited by gangs as well. Many special
education youth are in need of attention and lack self esteem. Gangs provide those
qualilties to youth and in turn some of these children form strong attachments to their
gangs. These children can be more easily manipulated by older gang members and are
sought out for exactly that quality.

For example, I was an expert witness in a gang homicide in Mississipi where an teen
from a family of youth with mental retardation and who also had a low IQ, was recruited
into a local gang. In a situation of conflict between gang members, the gang leader
ordered him to shoot his best friend and in a state of confusion and fear, he shot and
killed him to his later horror.

Of course special education children can also be slow to recognized a dangerous
situation or can misread danger. Special education children are clearly more at risk due
to the kind of unpredictable gang situation that exists in Chicago today.

Conclusion

I’ve drawn my conclusions from my own research and street contacts, and the broader
gang research literature. I’ve also looked over various documents of the plan for “safe
passsage” of children through extremely dangerous and volatile gang areas. In my opinion, the new, changed situation in Chicago of gang violence has not adequately
informed the school closing planning process.

a/ The current CPS school closing plans puts children from many closing schools
at serious risk of gang violence.
b/The travel of children between some schools will aggravate tensions between
gangs and some children are likely to be hurt or even killed.
c/ The “safe passage” plan does not appear to recognize the importance for
security of a fundamentally changed pattern of gang violence in Chicago today.
d/ The closing plans for schools where children would have to cross gang
boundaries should be delayed in order for a more interactive, informed
community involved planning process with special attention to gang issues.

I’m aware that training for safe passage has commenced and I’ve reviewed the
contracts. It is difficult to understand what the communty volunteers will do if violence
breaks out. Walking along with a group of kids does very little if a gang member has a
gun. If they “call 911” that hardly protects the children. A Chicago police official said
simply to me, “How can that protect kids?” What he meant was consistent with the
analysis in this report. If violence is spontaneous and unpredictable, calls to 911 occur
only after violence has broken out and are not a plan to keep children safe.

I also did not see anything that recognized that not all kids go to school on time and how
stragglers or kids who just come in late to school would be protected by the safe
passage volunteers. The shallowness of the safety plans for schools where children
need to cross gang boundaries seems to me to suggest a need for delay and
developing a more prudent, informed plan of how to deal with gang conflicts. In some
situations, it seems to me that the school closings themselves are ill-advised.

John M. Hagedorn, Ph.D. is a Professor of Criminology, Law, & Justice at the University
of Illinois-Chicago and has been researching street gangs for nearly 30 years, beginning
in Milwaukee, Wisconsin in 1984 and since 1996 in Chicago. He has been involved in
several international cross-cultural research projects, including participation in a Social
Science Research Council study of youth and organized violence. In 2010, he was a
Visiting Research Professor at Glasgow University comparing Chicago gangs to those
in Glasgow, Scotland. He is the author of three books, two on gangs, one on the child
welfare system, and is currently completing another book on gangs, organized crime
and corruption in Chicago that centers on the Chicago gang wars of the 1990s and their
consequences.


Social Science References on Chicago and Gang Violence

Block, Carolyn Rebecca and Richard Block. 1995. "Street Gang Crime in Chicago." Pp. 202-
210 in The Modern Gang Reader, edited by M. Klein, C. Maxson, and J. Miller. Los
Angeles: Roxbury.
Block, Carolyn Rebecca, Antigone Christakos, Ayad Jacob, and Roger Przybylski. 1996. "Street Gangs and Crime." Research Bulletin: Illinois Criminal Justice Information
Authority.
Block, Richard and Carolyn Rebecca Block. 1992. "Homicide Syndromes and Vulnerability:
Violence in the Chicago Community Over 25 years." Studies on Crime and Crime
Prevention 1:61-87.

Diamond, Andrew J. 2009. Mean streets : Chicago youths and the everyday struggle for
empowerment in the multiracial city, 1908-1969. Berkeley: University of California
Press.

Hagedorn, John M. 1998. "Post-Industrial Gang Violence." Pp. 457-511 in Youth Violence, vol.
24, Crime and Justice: An Annual Review of Research, edited by M. Tonry and M. H.
Moore. Chicago: University of Chicago.
—. 2004. "Housing and Homicide." Coalition for the Homeless, Chicago.
—. 2005. "Institutionalised Gangs and Violence in Chicago." Pp. 312-330 in neither War nor
Peace: International Comparisons of children and youth in organised armed violence,
edited by L. Dowdney. Rid de Janiero: 7Letras.
—. 2006. "Gangs, Institutions, Race, and Space: The Chicago School Reconsidered." Pp. 26-
64 in Gangs in the Global City: Reconsidering Criminology, edited by J. M. Hagedorn.
Champaign, IL: University of Illinois Press.
—. 2006. "Race Not Space: A Revisionist History of Gangs in Chicago." Journal African
America History 91:194-208.
—. 2008. A World of Gangs: Armed Young Men and Gangsta Culture, Edited by D. Judd.
Minneapolis: University of Minnesota Press.
Hagedorn, John M. and Brigid Rauch. 2007. "Housing, Gangs, and Homicide: What We can
Learn from Chicago." Urban Affairs Review 42:435-456.

Padilla, Felix. 1992. The Gang as an American Enterprise. New Brunswick: Rutgers University
Press.
Padilla, Felix M. and Lourdes Santiago. 1993. Outside the Wall: A Puerto Rican Woman's
Struggle. New Brunswick, NJ: Rutgers.

Papachristos, Andrew V. 2001. A.D., After the Disciples: The Neighborhood Impact of Federal
Gang Prosecution. Chicago: New Chicago Schools Press, Inc.
—. 2011. "Too big to fail: The science and politics of violence prevention." Criminology and
Public Policy 10:1053-1061.
Papachristos, Andrew V., David M. Hureaub and Anthony A. Bragab. 2013. "The Corner and
the Crew: The Influence of Geography and Social Networks on Gang Violence."
American Sociological Review 78:417-447.



Shaw, Clifford R. and Henry D. McKay. 1969. Juvenile Delinquency and Urban Areas.
Chicago: University of Chicago.

Short, James F. and Fred L. Strodtbeck. 1965. Group Process and Gang Delinquency. Chicago: University of Chicago.

Spergel, Irving A. 1984. "Violent Gangs in Chicago: In Search of Social Policy." 58:199-225.
— 1990. "Youth Gangs: Continuity and Change." Pp. 171-275 in Crime and Justice:An Annual
Review of the Research, vol. 12, edited by M. Tonry and N. Morris. Chicago: University
of Chicago.
— 1995. The Youth Gang Problem: A Community Approach. New York: Oxford University
Press.
— 2007. Reducing Youth Gang Violence: The Little Village Gang Project in Chicago. Lanham,
MD: AltaMira Press.

Spergel, Irving A. and G. David Curry. 1990. "Strategies and Perceived Agency Effectiveness
in Dealing with the Youth Gang Problem." in Gangs in America, edited by R. Huff.
Beverly Hills: Sage.

Thrasher, Frederic. 1927. The Gang: A Study of 1313 Gangs in Chicago. Chicago: University
of Chicago.

Venkatesh, Sudhir Alladi. 1997. "The Social Organzation of Street Gang Activity in an Urban
Ghetto." American Journal of Sociology 103:82-111.
—. 2000. American Project: The Rise and Fall of a Modern Ghetto. Cambridge, MA: Harvard
University Press.
Venkatesh, Sudhir Alladi, Isil Celimli, Miller, Douglas,, Alexandra Murphy, Inc. We the People
Media, and Beauty Turner. 2004. "Chicago Public Housing Transformation: A Research
Report." Center for Urban Research and Policy, Columbia University, New York City.

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by Hi I'm Chucky » December 30th, 2013, 12:09 am

Wait a minute 80 something murders in east garfield park :wtf: east garfield park only has like 20,000 people holy fuck. Im glad them days are over. I remember niggas hopping out on ANYBODY checking them had niggas in gangways and car loads

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by Hi I'm Chucky » December 30th, 2013, 12:10 am

98*

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by Hi I'm Chucky » December 30th, 2013, 12:11 am

latino gang history is sketchy in chicago

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by Wild 100s Chris » December 30th, 2013, 12:14 am

chicago highest murder count was in 1974 :rip:

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by MurdaWoodz438 » December 30th, 2013, 12:33 am

One thing I noticed while reading this was it seem like the Westside was more violent back then! Now it's a different story, the Southside is wicked right now!

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by Wild 100s Chris » December 30th, 2013, 12:33 am

TWENTY74 wrote:
Wild 100s Chris wrote:chicago highest murder count was in 1974 :rip:
the year D.b left :shoot: the whole black whole started for ya'll
indictment hurt yall 4real tho :lmao:

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by Wild 100s Chris » December 30th, 2013, 12:35 am

MurdaWoodz438 wrote:One thing I noticed while reading this was it seem like the Westside was more violent back then! Now it's a different story, the Southside is wicked right now!
southside neighborhoods but not southside projects :lol:

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by MurdaWoodz438 » December 30th, 2013, 12:48 am

East Garfield was beyond fucked up! 98 murders in 1992, what the hell was going back then? I mean like who was actually going at it THAT HARD?

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by Wild 100s Chris » December 30th, 2013, 12:55 am

TWENTY74 wrote:them 4's souls... the souls had to keep they land a lot died but they killed a lot .. :bow: while gds was getting own by they big bro's in the wood :lmao: they was feelin dat pain they started pickin up them gates n droppin dem rakes aint dat right chris
what big bros :lol: gd vs bd really get poppin til '93 n da woods

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by MurdaWoodz438 » December 30th, 2013, 12:55 am

TWENTY74 wrote:them 4's souls... the souls had to keep they land a lot died but they killed a lot .. :bow: while gds was getting own by they big bro's in the wood :lmao: they was feelin dat pain they started pickin up them gates n droppin dem rakes aint dat right chris
:lol:

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by Wild 100s Chris » December 30th, 2013, 1:03 am

TWENTY74 wrote:
Wild 100s Chris wrote:
TWENTY74 wrote:them 4's souls... the souls had to keep they land a lot died but they killed a lot .. :bow: while gds was getting own by they big bro's in the wood :lmao: they was feelin dat pain they started pickin up them gates n droppin dem rakes aint dat right chris
what big bros :lol: gd vs bd really get poppin til '93 n da woods
i was off but u get da picture u know ur big bros :lol: 3 komes before 6 :lmao: ..where u think them rakes go ??by the gate :lmao: once ya done u drop the rakes put it by the gate
thought u were talm bout sum goofys under da 5 :lmao: englewood 92% disciples

MurdaWoodz438
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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by MurdaWoodz438 » December 30th, 2013, 1:29 am

Wild 100s Chris wrote:
TWENTY74 wrote:
Wild 100s Chris wrote:
TWENTY74 wrote:them 4's souls... the souls had to keep they land a lot died but they killed a lot .. :bow: while gds was getting own by they big bro's in the wood :lmao: they was feelin dat pain they started pickin up them gates n droppin dem rakes aint dat right chris
what big bros :lol: gd vs bd really get poppin til '93 n da woods
i was off but u get da picture u know ur big bros :lol: 3 komes before 6 :lmao: ..where u think them rakes go ??by the gate :lmao: once ya done u drop the rakes put it by the gate
thought u were talm bout sum goofys under da 5 :lmao: englewood 92% disciples
He obviously talking about some more goofys, other than you, that's under the 6! :tiphat:

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Re: Oldschool Chicago gang-violence V.S. 2000's

Post by IDGNF » December 30th, 2013, 4:14 am

MurdaWoodz438 wrote:East Garfield was beyond fucked up! 98 murders in 1992, what the hell was going back then? I mean like who was actually going at it THAT HARD?
Garfield park still beyond fucked up. Same with north lawndale Aint shit change but the murder toll it seem. I think garfield park had a big population loss since then anyway. Englewood still going strong like the 80s and 90s.

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