ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST US

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ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST US

Post by loyalone » February 22nd, 2014, 1:12 am

WAS READING THROUGH SOME OF THESE POST AND WAS WONDERING ARE THESE SURENOS BEING BIASED OR ARE THEY REALLY STRONGER THAN THEM... IN FLA PENS BELIEVE IT OR NOT ITS ALOT OF SURENOS ACOUPLE IVE RAN INTO ACTUALLY WAS FROM CALIFORNIA THEY ALWAYS PAINTED A PICTURE OF THE NORTENOS AS WEAK AND BEING INVADED BY SURENOS I KNOW THSURENOS OUTNUMBER THEM LIKE 10 TO 1 IN CALI AND PROBALY A 100 TO 1 ON A US LEVEL MY QUESTION IS DO YOU THINK SURENOS ARE FAR MORE DOMINANT AND STRONGER THAN NORTENOS

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by 619Loc » February 22nd, 2014, 3:18 am

Norteños don't have the influence, numbers, resources or power to keep up with the SUR.

Their turf gets smaller every year.

In Southern Cali, there aren't any active Norteños or Norteño gangs.

They don't have the opportunity to set up shop in enemy territory.

Yet they face the reality of losing their grounds in the near future.

Norteño prison politics are splintering into drop out gangs

The Sur commands some of the biggest gangs around: 18st and MS 13

Sureños have a huge following outside of the county


Facts are not biased, just truthful.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by loyalone » February 22nd, 2014, 3:24 am

619Loc wrote:Norteños don't have the influence, numbers, resources or power to keep up with the SUR.

Their turf gets smaller every year.

In Southern Cali, there aren't any active Norteños or Norteño gangs.

They don't have the opportunity to set up shop in enemy territory.

Yet they face the reality of losing their grounds in the near future.

Norteño prison politics are splintering into drop out gangs

The Sur commands some of the biggest gangs around: 18st and MS 13

Sureños have a huge following outside of the county


Facts are not biased, just truthful.
honestly i can see surenos eventually affecting gang politics more and more throught the US even though alot of people will deny that or say im stupid or ignorant or how can i say that being latin folks thanks for your input 619 loc apreciate it i thought that the nortenos might have more influence and dudes was being biased thats crazy do you think nortenos will eventually become defunct?

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by loyalone » February 22nd, 2014, 3:24 am

619Loc wrote:Norteños don't have the influence, numbers, resources or power to keep up with the SUR.

Their turf gets smaller every year.

In Southern Cali, there aren't any active Norteños or Norteño gangs.

They don't have the opportunity to set up shop in enemy territory.

Yet they face the reality of losing their grounds in the near future.

Norteño prison politics are splintering into drop out gangs

The Sur commands some of the biggest gangs around: 18st and MS 13

Sureños have a huge following outside of the county


Facts are not biased, just truthful.
honestly i can see surenos eventually affecting gang politics more and more throught the US even though alot of people will deny that or say im stupid or ignorant or how can i say that being latin folks thanks for your input 619 loc apreciate it i thought that the nortenos might have more influence and dudes was being biased thats crazy do you think nortenos will eventually become defunct?

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by SinisterMinister » February 22nd, 2014, 3:35 am

The truth is surenos can be biased and they are deep, but they don't run all of Cali or every jail house like some of them dream. Some turf may have been lost, but they exaggerate. I can't see norte becoming defunct, unless one day these new gangs eventually get rid of the north or south politics and maybe by then the north/south will finally unite. It's really hard to say, but for now it will remain this way.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by loyalone » February 22nd, 2014, 4:01 am

if it was a race surenos are in the lead i mean they set up shop in northern cali not too mention 2 of the 3 largest latino gangs in the world are sureno MS13 &18STREET i mean can anyone really name a norteno gang with thousands of members?surenos are pretty much in every state some places do have fake ones or unofficial ones i give credit where its due the sur is a pretty efficient machine

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by 619Loc » February 22nd, 2014, 7:30 pm

loyalone wrote: honestly i can see surenos eventually affecting gang politics more and more throught the US even though alot of people will deny that or say im stupid or ignorant or how can i say that being latin folks thanks for your input 619 loc apreciate it i thought that the nortenos might have more influence and dudes was being biased thats crazy do you think. Nortenos will eventually become defunct?

I do have a bias, being from Southern California, having family, friends, and kin who are Southsiders.
But that doesn't change the facts.

Norteños are hanging on, but not thriving like the Southside.
The only way I see the North trumping the South is by dropping their ideals and ideology and joining the People nation.

That would be a double advantage, one for the North and 2 for the People nation to get grounds in Cali.

But that is highly unlikely.
Despite what Norteños, or should i say Norteño supporters (new booty generation of Northern Californians) say, Norte 14 is race conscious. The gang was formed by Chicanos for Chicanos, the imagery is Mexican themed and centered, the Huelga Bird is of Aztec origin, the Cesar Chavez referances and "La Causa" is Mexican related, the red is favored also becuase the Mexican flag has red, etc etc

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by OLDxENGLISH » February 22nd, 2014, 9:30 pm

Nortenos and Nuestra Familia are indeed powerhouses in California,there constantly ranked in the top 5 worst prison and street gangs in the United States,they got most Northern Cities on lock to where Surenos cant even come outside without getting shot or stabbed,,,,,,,,now are Nortenos deep? No not at all,the Surenos are deeper then Nortenos probably 5-10 to 1 but that also leaves room for more snitches and fakes,Nortenos from what ive seen are very careful with picking gang recruits,there motto is quality over quanitity..Another thing of why Surenos are invading Northern California is the high abundance of small towns that have no gangs yet,and also if u look at the split of Nor Cal and So Cal,Southern California part is very small in land size,Nortes have hugh amount of land size,so its very easy for enemies to sneak in.to me the strongest Surenos and Nortenos are about equal,its just who has the gun at the moment. im speakin from totally non bias cuzz i aint down with the north or south.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by SinisterMinister » February 23rd, 2014, 3:47 am

LOL N's some times hook up with people nation in other states, but in Cali that is irrelevant. Northerners may not be as deep as south siders, but still thousands deep. There may be surenos coming up north, but a lot of these so called surenos aren't from the south. Some did team up with real south siders, but some just started banging sur out of no where. Part of that mentality is that they believe they must be surenos to fight nortenos, unlike LA where you can start a sureno varrio to fight another sureno varrio. I can't think of a norteno varrio that was started to fight a norteno varrio.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by gee raider » February 23rd, 2014, 4:26 am

SinisterMinister wrote:LOL N's some times hook up with people nation in other states, but in Cali that is irrelevant. Northerners may not be as deep as south siders, but still thousands deep. There may be surenos coming up north, but a lot of these so called surenos aren't from the south. Some did team up with real south siders, but some just started banging sur out of no where. Part of that mentality is that they believe they must be surenos to fight nortenos, unlike LA where you can start a sureno varrio to fight another sureno varrio. I can't think of a norteno varrio that was started to fight a norteno varrio.

Exactly ns need to form alliance s outside. The state to survive. With other. Non factors. From chicago while sureno varrio s roll. Independent to the point. Where. Feuds. In socal are being played out in the east and midwest and downsouth with no other organization s on sight ...while. ns. Go to the next mans hood to peace treat. While surenos. Come off as enemy s from the begginin...serio. how many gangs from outside. Cali. Do ns. Beef it with? While sureno s beef it with practically. Everybody in the nation And they dam selves. It doesn't get crazyer than that.



And the fact of what u said about sur varrios in la makes me believe anybody can just call themselves something and slap a 14 and ur a norte while here no gang start s off claimin sureno on the street

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by gee raider » February 23rd, 2014, 5:00 am

As I was saying no sureno gang starts claimin sureno off the street not in southern cali the reason gangs start outhere is because a newer gang is establishi ng itself in an older gangs territory and when they make it to being a 13it legitamizes the click into a battle tested varrio having gone through the motion s of varrio warfare and are recognize d in the streets and prison as a varrio

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by 619Loc » February 23rd, 2014, 10:07 am

In Northern Cali, yes the Nortes are still the big doggs
They still have their grounds, but that grip loosens up everyday

Their claim to defend themselves by saying Sureños only pop up in rural places
And that's the only way that the Sur can infiltrate,
But why isn't the inverse true?
Why is it that the Norte can't infiltrate the Sur
They can't even set up in hick or developing towns in So Cal
Because their excuse has no validity.

The Sureños they diss from up North have more balls than any Norteño 'cause they set up in enemy territory which is something Norteños haven't be able to do in the last 70 years

Plus, isn't there a 19 St Sureño gang in SF thats been there since the beginning ?


This is the most non-biased info out there: Monster Kody said in his book that Surenos had won a statewide war for control of the yards by 1990.


That was from a Crip. A black man who was an enemy to Sureños.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by Pho » February 23rd, 2014, 1:13 pm

Nortenos still has most of their shit on lock and are still deep. They won't be going anywhere anytime soon. It's still popular among the local hispanics to bang Norte. You see these fools out and about all the time.

There are Sur that ride on the Nortes but they're not out in the open like that. You will see a bunch of Sur 13/X3 hitups on benches, restrooms, and shit though.

When i used to roam around Norcal in the 90's i saw a lot of local Chicanos banging the Sur. I think that was when the Sur vs Norte thing was at it's height IMO. A lot of locals still bang Sur but now i mostly see paisas half ass banging Sureno. A lot of Socal Surenos live up North but most of them are just working/living/hustling.

The Hispanic communities in Norcal have grown a lot. Small towns that were once populated by white farmers are all Mexican now. In the larger cities, the hispanic population just get's larger and larger. It's interesting to see how fast these towns change in just a couple of years span.

But the North will never set up shop in the South. It's just how things are.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by OLDxENGLISH » February 23rd, 2014, 1:22 pm

619Loc wrote:In Northern Cali, yes the Nortes are still the big doggs
They still have their grounds, but that grip loosens up everyday

Their claim to defend themselves by saying Sureños only pop up in rural places
And that's the only way that the Sur can infiltrate,
But why isn't the inverse true?
Why is it that the Norte can't infiltrate the Sur
They can't even set up in hick or developing towns in So Cal
Because their excuse has no validity.

The Sureños they diss from up North have more balls than any Norteño 'cause they set up in enemy territory which is something Norteños haven't be able to do in the last 70 years

Plus, isn't there a 19 St Sureño gang in SF thats been there since the beginning ?


This is the most non-biased info out there: Monster Kody said in his book that Surenos had won a statewide war for control of the yards by 1990.


That was from a Crip. A black man who was an enemy to Sureños.

The Difference is that Nortenos do not want any turf outside of Northern Cali,and Surenos motives are always to expand and invade which is why there up norte,so thats why, and plus Surenos use the border to there advantage and recruit alot of new mexicans.Nortenos They claim the north only thats why they only stay in the north,but if im not mistaken ive read that Nortenos and Surenos are both active in Fontana california which is in the south,because the police was talkin about a fight between them in the city.Now most likely the Norte gang in fontana are fake because NF doesnt allow Nortenos to go down south to live.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by SinisterMinister » February 23rd, 2014, 3:15 pm

I only brought up people nation, because somebody else did. Nortenos just some times hook up with somebody, who probably is a factor if it's out of state and most likely whoever they hooked up with has a common enemy. Just like some surenos out of state do hook up with somebody. Some n's in Kansas were hooked up with Spanish Disciples who were enemies with surenos, but they're enemies now to. I knew of a couple of nortenos in Fontana and they very much had permission to be there, but they were there to slang. No real n's are going to go to SO-CAL to recruit southerners.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by 619Loc » February 23rd, 2014, 3:46 pm

If having the Boarder meant an advantage, todo San Diego tuviera mas raza que Los. But that ain't the case.

Norteños don't set up shop in the Southland because it's not permitted, they simply can't it would be a suicide mission.

As I said earlier in the post, 14s still have their land but it's not a tight grip.

As for Norteños being active in Fonta that is a mothafucking lie, I told you dudes i got family from Westside Fontana Diablos. Trust me when i say there ain't Norteños active. There are Latin Kings but they are all TRECE, not a 5 or 6 with no relation to Chicago, just same generic name.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by OLDxENGLISH » February 23rd, 2014, 3:59 pm

619Loc wrote:If having the Boarder meant an advantage, todo San Diego tuviera mas raza que Los. But that ain't the case.

Norteños don't set up shop in the Southland because it's not permitted, they simply can't it would be a suicide mission.

As I said earlier in the post, 14s still have their land but it's not a tight grip.

As for Norteños being active in Fonta that is a mothafucking lie, I told you dudes i got family from Westside Fontana Diablos. Trust me when i say there ain't Norteños active. There are Latin Kings but they are all TRECE, not a 5 or 6 with no relation to Chicago, just same generic name.

Ive spoke to a Nuestra Familiero from Newark California and he said the NF Dont want to have Varrios in Southern California because that would defeat the purpose of being a NORTHERNER.Surenos have a different code and conduct,there mission is domination which is why they recruit in high numbers and make moves to northern california.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by 619Loc » February 23rd, 2014, 4:34 pm

That makes some sense, then again there would be no point in expanding to Texas and other places in the Southwest.


On a side note, I wanna point out that this is probably one of the more civilized discussions we've had on this section of the Hood Up

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by Bully » February 23rd, 2014, 4:43 pm

busters in Fontana? :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: cut it out.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by SinisterMinister » February 23rd, 2014, 5:52 pm

Well I wasn't the one who said northerners were active in Fontana. I said I heard of a couple that sold there, but that's all they were there for. They weren't down there to recruit southerners, because northerners don't recruit southerners. You can look it up online if you want, because the news did say nortenos were caught up down there. There is out of state n's n some don't like it, but it's not the same as getting southerners on the team.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by CaliKid » February 23rd, 2014, 6:38 pm

Yes nortenos are still a powerhouses in NorCal. NorCal is, land wise, 2 times bigger but only has half the population SoCal does. This is why it's so easy for surenos to set up shop in NorCal. Nortenos do not have the numbers to protect their own land. It's not about them being weak or lame. It's simple math. In the past 5 or 6 years I do think the NF and nortenos have decreased in numbers and maybe a little power, but that's more because of police and in house fighting, and because of a lot of drop outs. But nortenos still run NorCal. If u go to a NorCal city that does have both nortenos and surenos, 9 out of 10 times you'll see the nortenos walking around city like they own the place. It's rare to see surenos walking around freely in northern cities. They only come out when they need to. Despite surenos being in the north in good numbers they have had little effect on the NF and nortenos.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by SinisterMinister » February 23rd, 2014, 7:10 pm

I think I know what OE meant when he said the border was an advantage. Just look at what is just SOUTH of SD. What happened to the "big bad, cocky LA county Chicano southerner"? They didn't really care for paisas and they acted like they didn't care for anything above LA county. They ended wanting south siders to move into the north and I'm guessing they didn't end up caring if those south siders recruited northerners, especially these days. Some may have been born in Mexico and passed thru SO-CAL, but still not real southerners. I thought it was just these surenos from out of state or more so Nor~Cal that act like south of the border is what sur is, but I heard that's what gangs like ms ended up making it stand for also.

Some of these so called surenos didn't like n's for whatever reason, like they got picked on by some n they may have started claiming sur out of no where or joined up with some south siders that were established. San Fran's 19th st were basically those type of paisas n even used to ride paisa in the pen, but now it's seems like "northern surenos" are being more accepted. They made every Latino gang in the south bang sur, even if they were some Salvatrucha stoners or even nortenos if Bakersfield counts. :wtf: :lol: I mean I heard at least one of those Bakers varrios used to be n's, but switched up. Like I said, "the big bad, cocky LA county Chicano southerner" didn't care for anything above LA county once upon a time. With Bakers I think it was kinda split in the beginning, but I think la eme wants that to be sur. You might catch a few n's in Bakers, but either surenos will deny it or they will say it's not really SO-CAL..

It's almost like all these mixed up politics is what the sur is about now, which makes it feel more and more like it's not even about south vs. north any more.. The influence is definitely different, especially with things like Hollywood (LA) and everything. That's why as I get older and see this shit, it just seems more stupid to me. A lot of times we just end up talking about the same old chit to, so I need to figure out how to make YouTube videos and just make one about all this that I can just throw up when I feel like I want to address the subject.

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by gee raider » February 23rd, 2014, 10:27 pm

SinisterMinister wrote:I think I know what OE meant when he said the border was an advantage. Just look at what is just SOUTH of SD. What happened to the "big bad, cocky LA county Chicano southerner"? They didn't really care for paisas and they acted like they didn't care for anything above LA county.
whats wrong with south of sd?u do know that before illegal immigration and gangs became known to be hand in hand with centros that mexicans had been subjected to deportation a couple of times in the 60s,70s,80s meaning that so cal cholos layed down roots in those era's (whether those barrios survived ,thrived ,and evolved into something else is another story)but that proves that even then and since the beggining paisas were always in the mix ;even when northerners were suppose to be those farmeros and stuff its been talked about the irony how that didnt even appeal to the raza in ur motherland :shrug:


heres compton varrio 70 in tijuana and other sur gangs in mexico

http://artfromthestreets.blogspot.com/2 ... io-70.html

Image

SinisterMinister wrote: They didn't really care for paisas and they acted like they didn't care for anything above LA county. They ended wanting south siders to move into the north and I'm guessing they didn't end up caring if those south siders recruited northerners, especially these days.
many people would agree that theres never been a movement calling for surenos to move upstate it just happened ,centros never thought about moving into central america and expanding it just happened...many of them didnt understand the culture of the customs or reality of what it really was downthere and in their minds they were chicano's
[youtube]<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/nKq0wGLoQGo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>[/youtube]

9:04 "it never crossed my mind in La what el salvador was ,I knew it was a country and thats where we came from ,I didnt realize... this was going to be permanent ,I was just planning on staying here a week....I was totally lost down here I couldnt fit in nowhere My accent was more mexican then salvadorian like they couldnt understand me"



...they were just looking to sign a paper and get the fuck out of prison ..at least on the 18st side because 18st was the first gang to hit the centros first ..temple maybe too but they were wiped out...

SinisterMinister wrote:Some may have been born in Mexico and passed thru SO-CAL, but still not real southerners. I thought it was just these surenos from out of state or more so Nor~Cal that act like south of the border is what sur is, but I heard that's what gangs like ms ended up making it stand for also.

:facepalm: and u want to make youtube videos?
why would it be so strange for some surenos to be spanish speaking south of the border raza when its been over 30 to 40 years since so cal varrios and cholos set foot laying the foundation for the barrio lifestyle across the border...and the title of southerner is earned not given but killing nortenos on the streets can at least get u a pass to stay in the car...
SinisterMinister wrote:Some of these so called surenos didn't like n's for whatever reason, like they got picked on by some n they may have started claiming sur out of no where or joined up with some south siders that were established. San Fran's 19th st were basically those type of paisas n even used to ride paisa in the pen, but now it's seems like "northern surenos" are being more accepted.

idk im not from nor cal but ill find it hard to believe that all of them were punks
some just probably didnt like the whole norte getdown even back then.... :lol:

SinisterMinister wrote:They made every Latino gang in the south bang sur, even if they were some Salvatrucha stoners or even nortenos if Bakersfield counts.
u do know that ms stoners was just the most notorious stoner gangs in los angeles but there was more stoner gangs active in east los with the chicanos ask somebody..and by the time ms became sur they were already into the cholo soldado thing having been through barrio warfare and respected in La before the greenlight ...

ill adress the other shit later....maybe...

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by 619Loc » February 24th, 2014, 12:00 am

I agree with Gee.
The Chicano identity has extended itself to the Centros.
I keep saying we are one people time and time again.
I know many people of Salvadoran descent who are married/dating Mexicans
When it comes down to the nitty gritty only accents seperate us.


Gee's also on point with the comment about Upstate Sureños.
You dudes discredit them by saying they're rejects or got bullied by Nortes
But the more likely alternative is that they just didn't see Norte as the model they were looking for.
Especially if they are recent immigrants, they know black a mannerisms aren't OUR identity.
As I have said, Norteños are and thrive on the idea that they are Americanized Brown People,
Distancing themselves from the cholo look, the spanish language, the mannerisms of the chicano through newer generations.

To add to Gee's comment, Comptone 70's - Lomita Village 70's from Diego and the 70's from TJ are connected.
I keep telling you dudes Tijuas is an extension of SD and vise versa.
That varrio in LA called Tepas originated from Tepatitlan, Mexico.

There are dozens of California barrio transplants in Mexico.


@Gee
There's this vato named Lone Wolf who runs a blog on California barrios,
He's got this post on detailed information of how MS was schooled and shaped by barrio politics
I'll post it later

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Re: ARE NORTENOS A POWERHOUSE IN NORTH CALI OR THE NORTHWEST

Post by reggiw » February 24th, 2014, 12:08 am

it's ironic to see MS and 18 cited here as examples of influential sureno groups, when neither one of them are traditional chicano barrios. in the beginning they were both outsiders.

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